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I’ll tell you this is a long way from being inmate number 408 92424 well your I must say your prison story I’ve heard a lot of prison stories one of the most incredible I’ve ever heard yeah I’m writing a book about it you should and it’s an unusual story it’s a story that starts with one President Obama he started the whole thing because he sent someone to me to make a political deal for the senator ends with Trump okay and in and most of it’s about a governor in prison with Crips and bloods Gangster Disciples senol cartel drug dealers who look up to El Chapel like my daughters look up to Taylor Swift murderers were in there for my first 3 years I liveed in a 6t by 8ot prison cell Far Cry from the 50,000 ft Governor’s man well it’s incredible but what’s incredible to me was the fact that you survived it mentally not just intact but stronger and I just find that I mean if you had killed 10 people it’s not even about I mean I think you got screwed as you know but even if you hadn’t gotten screwed I would still be in awe of your toughness uh emotional spiritual toughness to come out positive focused not bitter I mean that’s that’s remarkable to me thank you thanks for saying that no I mean it what’s so obvious if I had how long were you away 2,896 days one month short of eight years not that I was counting it’s just I’m sorry to laugh your first sent no but it’s just uh it’s remarkable [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] three years in that 6ot by 8ot prison cell you know in the higher prison where they were squeezing me you know with the gang bangers murderers bank robbers pedophiles uh transgender people who were half woman half man funded by you the taxpayer mermaids and you can’t call them a woman or they’ll throw you in the shoe solitary confinement that take away your good time so I know what it’s like to live in a society that’s imposing what you can even say you know having been there for that time um but no you what it was well that’s that’s such a smart point I mean they’re basically trying to turn the country into an open air prison where they control your behavior your language your thought yeah well said faith hope and love it’s what got me home faith hope and love you know and you know you get those moments when you’re you find yourself in deep dis SP and you feel like there’s no chance the system is so rigged you can’t get Justice you can’t even get Mercy because you thought back no one even said I took a penny it was all politics request for campaign contributions no quid pro call we knew where the lions were tried me twice and uh then you put your faith in the appell court and then they you know they can’t uphold this the so-called s the seny because if they allow that standard government shuts down because that’s all horse trading and that’s what they called it and they were right so they eventually reverse that but I’m known for this um the other ones were three fundraising requests made by Third parties not even by me and they knew not to make any promises or threats and uh they criminalized it by using a standard that the Supreme Court said wasn’t the law and it was whitewashed by the the appella Corp to protect them and uh you know you get those moments but then you say to yourself you you know it ain’t about you anymore it’s about your daughters they were little girls when I left home and your wife you got to be strong for them and as long as you have purpose in life you can survive anything and Victor Frankle wrote that book man search for meaning Holocaust Survivor I mean million times worse than anything we went through but his point was the last of the human freedoms is our freedom to choose our own attitude and any given set of circumstances it was very helpful and I got to tell you and this is not baloney am I on right now yeah yeah the Bible I mean I was so alone in the beginning and I reached for that Bible in a way I never did before I I wasn’t going to bother with the genis or Leviticus or Deuteronomy get caught up in who’s begetting who cuz that would always slow me down when I try to read it in the real world I went right to the right right to the Psalms and got inspiration and then I moved on I went to Isaiah and Jeremiah then I went to the gospels Paul of course and well all of them and speaking in prison terms exactly in Rome yeah Paul did a lot of time he sure did and it just gave me strength and and Drew me closer to God I’m not running for anything so I’m not below you know giving any BS to your listeners it was just real and in some respects I’m not saying it was good but I’d have moments over the years where I would actually feel you know some sort of real unique connection to God and it was somewhat like what soul Zenit had written when he was in Siberia and he had talked about he he had said something like thank you prison for what you did for me because oh but for what you did I would not feel as close to God as I do now boy that’s just such a remarkable perspective such a non-american perspective thank you for prison yeah that’s what he said yeah that’s what he wrote I’m not quite going that far but no but I think what you’re saying is that suffering turned you into a different man a better man yeah I think it yes and I think uh a greater appreciation for the things that really matter most in life you know like the people in your life that you love and the appreciation for the simple things that maybe you were you know a little bit less aware of cuz you were so busy in the race of life to get ahead right um no iPhone must been nice yeah there was no iPhone in the world at that time when I left home when I got home 8 years later what is this thing right wow the world changes and that’s another thing it’s humbling is it okay if I keep talking like this I hope you will yeah it’s like you ain’t so good you ain’t so great man it ain’t like the world waits for you it just keeps spinning around man huh that is the true in the end all Graves go and visited that should be on everybody’s refrigerator wow your party changed when gone to how what did you notice when you get back um um well I noticed this whole new thing called wokeness and cancel culture which I wasn’t aware of before I left um I noticed the intolerance of the farle of the Democrat Party I noticed that my daughters my little girls grew up and became vegans um not that they’re you know far left but that was weird I’m sorry I think that’s it I mean there’s nothing you I’m not against you know whatever eat whatever you want or whatever you you know don’t eat what you don’t want to eat on the other hand that’s that’s like the fear of every father that your girls are going to become vegans cuz it feels like it represents something else but it has nothing to do with diet it’s that they you know they feel like it’s wrong to you know eat me to you know kill an animal and it’s a very sweet kind thing on their point of I agree um and then you know I came home to a you know workingclass neighborhood in Chicago I mean we live a nice little neighborhood but um where the local Democrat Party began to turn socialist and uh you know the local city council people we call him Alderman in Chicago um I think in 200 19 my sister-in-law was the alderman in our W she had inherited that seat from her father been there for a long long time yeah and she got beat by a socialist lost by 12 votes but a socialist that was like shocking to me and then some of the other long-standing members of the city council were defeated by socialists and so suddenly that was this new uh realization that the Democrat Party at the Grassroots love was radicalized were they good at governing the Socialists no they’re terrible at governing and now we’re going to get a major property tax increase in Chicago the mayor Brandon Johnson just announced that and as I read that uh this morning I was thinking driving here geez I wonder if we’re GNA we have any risk of getting carjacked up here in bethl right because in Chicago you got to think about those things it’s just funny I mean it’s you know people have all these ideologies and I’m a this or I’m a that I believe you know here’s my my worldview but I don’t know on some level it’s kind of about do you make the town the state the country better to live in or not and you’re saying that the people who took over Chicago did not improve life no they’ve made it more unsafe they’re unwilling to have any kind of opened minded discussion about the fact that the schools have been failing for generations and most of the kids that are suffering are the black kids yeah for sure they talked a big game about being the side of the black people but they won’t even give a black mother a choice or a chance to maybe try another school because the public schools are so locked in to what the teachers unions want and I’m not here to say that I wasn’t exactly you know part of that Democrat Party and the unions and the teachers union you were part of it that’s why it’s so interesting well well yeah you’re a product of you’re the governor of the state right and you came out of that world I did so well that’s why it’s worth asking you about this because you’ve seen you’ve seen the whole scope of it that’s right from the daily years to present that’s right and you know the Democrat Party that I was in the party of the second mayor daily the party the first mayor daily um practical you know practical governance just make people’s lives better the best snow plowing in the United States when it snowed Chicago got plowed before the suburbs it was I saw it it was amazing yes that’s right and um not too stuck on ideology but there were certain values that were fundamental to traditional Democrats what were they love of country well faith family love of country and uh this Democrat Party is none of those three and there is an assault on faith in America by these Democrats by the more radical Democrats and it’s something that has grown over the last couple of decades something I saw when I was a democratic member of Congress I hope I don’t turn your listeners off but I supported Pelosi to be the Democrat leader when I was there I saw even the beginnings of that when they were trying to take God out of the you know the the in God we trust her well she’s a Catholic girl from Baltimore son of the mayor she was very I mean she was the son of Baltimore’s mayor Dy like an old school machine Democrat right that’s right but uh but she changed because she’s a practical politician and so she’s gravitated towards that energy in the Democrat party today which is that far leue farle socialist Democrat Party that wants to rechange America and you say this and I’ll repeat what you say and that is to force us and make us to try to believe things we know they’re just not true yes right and that’s this dictatorial Democrat Party but you saw hostility to Christianity when you were there I did Growing yeah in the late 90s I did you know they’ be once in a while there’ be res Congressional resolutions to take God out of the um the chamber the house chamber and then there was the judge in Alabama Roy Moore I’m proud to say that back in the late 90s as a Democrat congressman from the city of Chicago I supported that judge why can’t he put the Ten Commandments up there in his Courthouse what’s wrong with the Ten Commandments that’s the foundation of our laws it’s the foundation of our values so I that’s literally true it is the foundation of sure is yeah yeah so so why were people so hysterical about Judge Roy Moore I mean they they destroyed Judge Roy Moore yeah I know as a person I saw that from afar from the deep Dar Valley I watched all that um because there’s a you know there’s an element in America and it’s found a home of the Democrat Party that’s all about science and absolutely nothing about religion I think the part of the Coalition is the Democrat party and I’ve been supportive of of lgbtq issues but I think they feel threatened by judeo-christian values and so they’ve become in many respects antagonistic to those Traditional Values and these are some of the Practical considerations that are part of why a lot of these Democrats have left the traditional Democrat you know working person’s view of God and have become more apt to embrace science and you know one of the I’m not saying there’s any advantages to be in prison for a long time yeah but when you got all that time and you got to kill it you either try to use it constructively or it’ll kill you yes and it’s a good place to catch up on your reading yeah and I I used to read a lot of the sermons from Martin Luther King and and one of his sermons was really powerful and he talked about what science can do the good things but it’s God it’s God that provides the conscience to God SCI to guide science yes and you know science creates the medicines that cure people which is great also created the nuclear weapons that can destroy the world what it is it that’s going to guide that are we going to trust in people I know how people can be I know how Wicked they can be the best and brightest can be corrupt because I know what they did to me and to my family it was shocking to me that us attorneys could be so dishonest and corrupt and that the judge would be in on it just go along with it and uh so my Faith’s not in people so you were shocked I mean obviously you’re distressed it happened to you but you were shocked that it happens yes I thought they were the good I was a Cook County prosecutor when I started out in a low level yeah Dy the second mayor of daily at the time was the elected cook H Sates attorney and he was my boss so he’s way up high and I’m a traffic court right just starting out there like 800 of us assistants big you know big office I ended up in the MISD Branch courts and then I went into private practice so I never met him when I worked for him it was only until I became an elected official and then in 10 short years I became the governor he was the mayor he still thought I worked for him by the way I bet yeah but um that’s a fraught relationship always between Chicago mayor and Illinois governor anyway isn’t it yeah I think so but I I think that he’s prac iCal and you know these Democrats you know have programs and stuff that they want to pay for and you know bloated budgets are not a priority and even the old school Democrats that’s not a priority it’s you know jobs and yeah you know opportunities for people who’ve helped and that kind of thing but um the point I wanted to make about da was when I worked in that states attourney office you know I I learned a lot about how you know prosecutors operated and they were all right mostly good but I imagine that the ederal us attorneys who went to the better schools you know I could never have a chance to be one of them right grades I was a gentleman C scholar in law school that these people had to be really smart really bright and they had to be super honest compared to the local Democratic prosecutors yeah many of whom you know had some political uh backing to get their jobs and I discovered they are in my case anyway I’m I don’t want to speak generally about everybody but they are so corrupt you can’t get a fair trial if they’re look at Andrew Weissman you know was at the very top of was a truly evil man evil and you know Weissman I’m sure is a was smart clever anyway and certainly well credentialed and has almost unchecked power I mean it’s crazy that that exists so he destroyed Arthur Anderson with fake law that’s what they did to me fake law they just make it up they just move lines to get the convictions Supreme Court took the case and weissman’s standard that used to destroy Arthur Anderson and cost all those people jobs nine to nothing the Supreme Court ruled he was wrong that wasn’t the law oh yeah yeah so he destroyed the and what does he get for that he gets rewarded by being some big commentator on CNN and people listen to this guy like he’s like he’s honest it’s disgusting it is disgusting so what not to get sidetracked but what the what is the daily fam I think R daily still alive right yes yes what do they think of the modern democratic party KLA Harris Joe Biden like what do they think of that so Bill Dy yeah yeah of course ran for mayor of Chicago while I was in prison yeah and shockingly got his ass kicked in the new Chicago and that’s when Lori lighfoot was elected the new kind of Mayor in Chicago right she was a big failure and she got defeated soundly but the fact that a daily could lose in Chicago was another reminder that boy times have changed different population in Chicago very different demographic now the city that used to be you know diverse racially you know very strong still you know black population still in the poor bad rough neighborhoods a big Latino population but it was a city of white working class white ethnic yeah central eastern European people that’s right large polish population Slavs that’s right um that element is gone now you know they two three generations they worked hard to build better lives for themselves they taking advantage like our friend Philip over here yeah working hard to make the American dream they’ve moved upward out of the city and into you know more affluent suburbs but they were the basis of the city they sure were and they’ve been replaced by these young you know Young new generation not very politically aware you know probably driven by the social issues more than anything else uh you know a woman’s right to choose those kinds of issues right so they’ve been replaced by affluent white inherited money kids that’s right and illegal aliens generally speaking that’s exactly right right so that’s that’s always the model it’s rich white women and illegal aliens working in tandem to destroy civilization um it is in cities across the country that is the model um uh the unhappiest people and the most you know the the people with the least power who just can be used as Canon fodder for the program of the unhappiest people so um but do you know what the daes think of this like watching their City become a joke well look I know that I Know Rich Daly better than Bill dy I knew I know them both and then there’s John Dy the younger one and the father I mean this is not their Democratic party no and uh mayor daily who’s in ear 80s now he hosts a Christmas party every year and I get invited I get to see him and he’s had a couple of strokes and then he hosts a St Patrick’s Day party as you can imagine does um I think he’s quietly gonna vote for Trump I’m sure yeah and I bill Dy maybe not because he’s sort of you know he was more like Bill Dy didn’t win elected office he was more an appointed guy you know yeah he worked for Bill Clinton he still that’s right and um well I don’t want to demean him but he doesn’t have the same kind of testicular vity you got to have to be in the arena and be good at it you know what I’m saying Run Chicago is not an easy thing as the current mayor is proving yeah know it’s right no until not that long ago the 1990s the US government classified encryption as a form of Munitions and strictly controlled its use in other words encryption was considered a dangerous weapon both technology and law have changed a lot since then but it’s still true that encryption is a powerful weapon against a defensive weapon against an entire Army of Bad actors who want to invade your privacy on the internet and then profit from it or control you thankfully today you have the right to use encryption to protect yourself you don’t have to be a sophisticated computer programmer you don’t have to code in order to do it instead you can use a simple app called expressvpn expressvpn automatically encrypts and reroutes your internet connection through secure servers and that makes everything you do Online private no one can monitor record manipulate or profit from what you do 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and all that he was a sign of Hope um and then it just got super evil but when did you realize that Obama was not what he seemed to be and what role did he play in the disaster in your life he started the whole thing you know my story that the book that I’m writing is a story that started with him on Election night in 2008 it was magical you know first black person half black and you from Kansas dad from Kenya elected president I’ve known him since 1995 we both came up together in politics had good relationships I was introduced to him by a guy by the name of Tony Resco I think that name is familiar to you who’s not nearly what the guy who’s been portrayed I mean businessman very practical extremely generous to Obama and good to Obama helpful to both of us raising money and things like that and when I was elected governor he would come to me with requests from Obama and you know a lot of it were appointments to High positions in state government I was two years ahead of Obama in terms of going to the next level because I was the first Democrat Governor elected in Illinois in 2002 and with this long and hard to pronounce last name which was kind of Cutting Edge at the time because for the most part Illinois was electing guys with Anglo names or Irish names you know we had Thompson we had Edgar and we had Ryan before me all those guys went to prison well Ryan did yeah Thompson put that governor kerer in prison that’s another story but uh um and then I won it’s like being a first lieutenant in Vietnam the odds are bad right exactly right the death rate but I think in some respects I’m you know I should apologize to the American people because I might have had something to do with Obama’s success because I think he saw that I if I won and I could win down state in the rural areas and you know deep southern Illinois which is the American South a guy like me from Chicago he could do it and with a a name you can’t say his name he could do it and two years later he did and he got the opportunity to give that speech in Boston which was his William Jennings Bryant moment right he electrified the crowd with that speech I was there yeah so was I I turned to Bobby Rush the congressman former black panther I said Bobby just think about that as soon as you got done with that speech you’re the only guy who’s ever beaten that guy in an election because Obama challenged him in 1998 um but no I thought Obama was all right you know kind of cold and impersonal but okay and I was happy to be helpful uh but he’s one of the more selfish people in politics on a one-on-one level and he’s not pure like the driven snow in the the sense of his ethics or morality and you know Tony Resco is the guy who bought this lot next to Obama’s home and one of the things I write about in my book is that when I was governor first and then Barack won in 2004 I was asked to make a phone call on behalf of Michelle Obama because as soon as he won the senate race she wanted a job either at Northwestern University or the University of Chicago hospitals for $200 to $300,000 a year the the wife of the new Senator and I was asked would you call and was she specific about how much she wanted yeah she specific about salary yeah and I think to Northwestern we should double check this but I think my recollection is is good I think Northwestern was willing to pay $200,000 to hire her this is the wife of the new US senator and federal money for you know Medicaid and Medicare things like that and then um they got a better offer at the University of Chicago which is in Hyde Park where they’re from 300,000 and she ended up working there and uh and i’ call to help because you know you help people in politics and the guy’s wife wants a job I’ll make a phone call he didn’t get it she didn’t get it because of me but it didn’t help to have didn’t hurt to have the governor call and say second Obama gets elected Michelle says I want a job Y at one of two hospitals for between two and 300,000 cor yeah and she ended up working at the University of Chicago hospital almost certain $300,000 a year and uh so rco was really helpful really helpful to Obama and and so when the investigations against me heated up it had to do with fundraising and Tony was part of that and I got to say this Tony suffer he spent eight years in prison I don’t know whether those things that they said he did were even legal based on what they did to me I’m not so sure they were illegal had nothing to do with my Administration they were business matters um but Obama just ran from him did nothing to help him and uh you know pretends like he never knew him and yet the moment he became Senator she gets that $300,000 a year job with a little help tiny little bit of help from me with a phone call and then they buy this mansion in the Kenwood neighborhood which is High Park Chicago beautiful old Mansions where the family of Leopold and L they lived right um so a lot of sickos in that neighborhood going back a 100 years well those guys those two boys were yeah yeah right I mean it’s a Bastion of you know liberal America therey l but so what happened was uh the Obamas bought this Mansion now he’s the new Senator the first thing they do is buy a mansion I guess he felt like I was getting a mansion because I was the governor it wasn’t mine but I got the use of a 50,000 foot Governor’s Mansion I guess they wanted their own so they they could only afford 750,000 so they they uh purchased the lot with the house on it the Mansion on it but they couldn’t afford the adjoining lot so they asked Resco to buy it for him and he did and uh my understanding of the federal investigations with me were also connected to Obama that these guys were apparently looking into that and some other things along the way the dynamic changed Obama started moving up in the presidential race and uh here again I it’s something i’ like to take back but I was the first governor in America to endorse him for President we had a personal relationships from Illinois and he was running against Hillary so it wasn’t hard yeah um but um what ultimately happened was uh you know he when he started Rising axar Rod David who used to work for me and then went on to Obama I I knew what they were doing they were for political reasons they were you know influencing the media to pretty much lay Tony me up more than than than Obama I was more tonyi up and Tony was a supporter and a friend and he was and and I like Tony in spite of everything that’s happened to him but Obama knew him and loved him longer and Tony had done more for Obama over the years than he did for me and ultimately politically and in the media the media just conveniently ignored rco’s relationship to Obama they would give it very little coverage and it was all about me and Tony so Axel Rod worked for you he did when I was a congressman when I ran for congress what’s he like he’s very smart you know I like him a lot his son was an insurent for me his son Michael he’s a great kid he’s growing up now um no I like David a lot but he’s a very practical guy and he’s very ambitious politically and you know it’s a rough and tumble business and you know when his interests collide with yours you know his one out he will exercise what’s in his interest yeah and I think a lot of the political Consultants are that way he denies saying this but he did when when Carrie had been beaten by Bush in 2004 and the Democrats all felt like Carri was going to win in fact Carri was getting some massage in Boston that night election night and um what the guy name used to write great speeches for Ted Kennedy Bob Shrum Shrum shum watched in and said walked in and told him something like I’d hear this stuff from the Democrat world you know um let me be the first one to congratulate you Mr President right remember that then the next morning it was finally concluded that bush won Ohio right I knew them all very well and Shrum you know had good qualities he smart but what a Toady what a professional Fator of politicians it’s just really disgusting so that was a Tuesday right and of course Wednesday I get a phone call about 6:00 in the evening I’m at home election’s over David axod now he denies this but it happened and he said you know um the Democrats Hillary’s the front runner in 2008 but were too liberal too disliked Carrie should have won he couldn’t we’re looking for a new face somebody from the heartland of America that’s what he called it you need to have an open mind about thinking about running for president and challenging Hillary in 2008 now at that time he had Obama Obama was his candidate for the Senate he had been his consultant Obama won and he was had that great speech and you know he was but I think David wasn’t quite sure that maybe America was ready to elect a black person so he’s in the business of being a consultant he’s make wants to make sure he has has a horse in the race because the clintons already have their people he had Edwards in 2004 and go well yeah so he’s looking for candidates for president so vilac remember that name me in Illinois and Obama the three of us he was trying he was probably positioning himself to see which one of us might have the the better chance and he picked the right horse eventually because Obama was the right one and of course Obama’s success and and my Calamity parallel right and so you asked me this is a long answer to your question about 55 minutes ago what did Obama have to do with my my problems was election night we’re there and a labor Boss by the name of Tom balinov service employees union big supporter of both of us came up to me this Grant Park in Chicago beautiful weather magical historic night and he said barock called me last night he wanted me to talk to you about Valerie Jared he’d like her very close friend of Michelle Obama by the way he’d like you to appoint her to the United States Senate because the governor asked to appoint the senator and uh he wanted me to ask you what you would want can I call you and come and see you and make an appointment I said of course call me tomorrow we’ll set something up this week that’s how it started and then at the next day I got done running I went out and ran like eight eight miles that day seven miles I’m just loosening up I’m laying on my little family room floor stretching I’m not back and I’m talking to one of my AIDS and I said a Balon off called apparently Obama said him to me Obama sent him to me he wants to make a deal on the senate seat what what should we do what should we think about getting legal stuff not you know give me cash or anything which would be illegal political horse trading which eventually is what the Supreme Court I mean pelic cour said it was and then I say and you know unless I do something you know significant this will be in my obituary I said so and so had suggested that uh we just kiss his ass and give him whatever he wants but that seems like that would be political malpractice and we have a golden opportunity we have a real opportunity here to you know do something meaningful and then I said I know it this is effing golden I’m not given enough for nothing right I’m known for that and you didn’t realize this was being taped I didn’t realize it but let me say something to your listeners when you’re in Chicago politics and the ethics in that place and the way they do business and the way the feds not wrongly necessarily try to set people up to see whether or not they’re they’ll take a Temptation they send people in they give you offer you cash and stuff like that you’d be an idiot if you don’t think they may be listening I it wasn’t I’d been under federal investigation for 5 years I knew it because of the rco stuff and some other stuff people who who were supporters of mine and Obama I mean I thought it’s all very possible and everything I’m talking about doing is legal and I was super careful because I was under such intense federal investigation at that time to make sure that anything I talked about doing I checked with my Governor’s lawyer and lawyers and my lawyer was on the on average and all these FBI tapes they tape my calls to this day 98% of those tapes are covered up under a court seal the judge would not allow us to talk about how my lawyer was on those calls three times a day cuz at that point you know now you know they’re coming you want be absolutely careful that whatever you do on the senate seat is legal oh right and so you you’re throwing out all kinds of ideas CU you do have this fingold an opportunity we talked about Oprah for a couple of days all these crazy ideas and um everybody wanted it everybody wanted me to appoint them as you can imagine and you know and through third parties or suggesting deals that were political they weren’t illegal some had suggested money and campaign funds which would have been illegal and um but I would talk to my Lord you know three times a day and and he he was advising me in fact one call I say something like you know we’re try we’re discussing a creative way to create a nonprofit political action committee to help support the advancement of access to health care which was a big issue for me when I was governor and Obama was talking about doing Obamacare and all this at the federal level and some of the people that had put our healthc care plans together in Illinois went on to work for Obama and so the question was whether or not there was something that we could do to be helpful to push it further in Illinois and do something and could we put together a 501c3 or 501c4 Obama gets some of these Big Rich Democrats who give money to him to put in our thing and can we uh you know perhaps make the deal on the cency for something like this and so I say to the lawyer and to one of my AIDS I say I mean how do you do a deal like that I mean it’s got to be legal obviously I’m on the tape saying that couple years goo by I’m at my second trial because they failed to convict me on their corrupt charges the first trial and that they’re going to play that tape against me and I’m be actually charged one of my the crimes it was that phone call how do you do a deal like that I mean it’s got to be legal obviously I’m asking I don’t even know if you could do it I’m just thinking out loud and they criminalized it but surely I’m going to get acquitted on this but the jury instruction was custom tailored to fit these conversations to tell the jury that those things were criminal and they can coni convict anybody if they do that if they decide for example that this conversation you and I are having and they CRI you know they charge us and then they got to prove it before a jury and they got a judge is willing to do anything they want them to do all they got to do is just write up a jury instruction 12 laymen average everyday ordinary people who aren’t lawyers aren’t in politics just tell them this is against the law and they’ll make the right decision they’ll convict you of this conversation because they’re told by the judge and the prosecutors it’s the against the law so big picture why do you think they did this to you the Democratic establishment did this to you well they were Bush prosecutors that started it here’s what I think happened so it’s Gerald that’s right that guy’s so dirty and rotten and corrupt I’ve noticed yeah um here’s what they so they came at six o’clock in the morning and arrested a sitting Governor I mean I was Roger Stone years before Roger Stone right my little girls are sleeping at you know ready going to get up shortly for school my little one at the time was five and um she was in bed with us and I got up at six I was going to actually go run that this winter I was going to go run I had my running clothes lay down phone rang and I thought it was a friend of mine the guy says I we have a warrant for your arrest and the Agents so and so I had State Police security all the time as the governor and I thought it was a friend of mine I say this a lot because he’s like that way I really did I said come on state senator Jimmy Deo and I said come on Jimmy stop effing around 6:00 in the morning but it wasn’t him it was really the FBI with a warrant um I think they they got me handcuffed me drove me to their facility by 4 hours later by 10:00 they were good cop and they had me in and you’re not a bad guy we listen to all your tapes you’re just the product of Chicago politics they wanted me to cooperate I believed my interpretation was they wanted me to talk about Obama I don’t think they were ever going to go after Obama at that point for his black president but I think they wanted to see whether or not I would here’s a prison term snitch on the president-elect and then go back and him to him and say that they probably told him that anyway because they lie in any event I said there’s you know I was never involved in any wrong doing with him I don’t know whether he he’s involved in anything of that sort I can tell you I’m not and I got nothing to talk about it whatever I discussed was politics and uh then they got it they changed their attitude they shipped me to another facility the court building and put me in a small little cell and they had me next to this really angry guy all caught up on PCP you know screaming and MF and he had no clue that he was right next to the governor you know I’m doing push-ups in there because I’m thinking this is really this is really a bad day and this is going to be really bad and may but maybe at some point I want to be able to say that while I was in the Heat of the Moment I still was strong enough to do some push-ups in my cell so I did push-ups in there so I can say that I did it right and uh plus if you’re going to join a gang you need to be buff yeah there’s truth to that yeah anyway so I think and then they went to Obama the next day and they did they interviewed him they call him 302 FBI 302s every criminal defendant is entitled under the Constitution to have evidence that could exonerate him or her and Obama’s 302s are relevant directly relevant to my case to this day they won’t give it to us what Obama said and he publicly contradicted what the labor boss balinoff had said that he had come to me the night before cuz it all started that way and and balanov had testified under oath twice in two trials that he said that Obama had called him and sent him over to me and you know it was about talking about a political deal and Obama publicly said no what he said in those FBI 302s might contradict that I don’t know if you lie to the FBI you know it’s a crime um so I think what what happened was because it’s unusual and you know this the new president doesn’t keep the US attorney from the previous president especially if it’s the other party of course but suddenly now they made a deal with Obama we’ll leave you alone you keep us here until we get him and it wasn’t until they got me at the second trial years later that they all went into private practice and became partners of big firms making millions of dollars one lady one of them became a judge but Fitz jer’s a partner in a big Law Firm the Le Pro the lead prosecutor partner in a big law firm and the moment that they got their convictions against me in the second trial that’s where they went and I think the reason Obama did nothing to be helpful while I’m in there and after being in prison for well five and a half six six and a half years I was unusual unlike the 151,000 federal inmates I was probably the only guy who was able to get this is the vernacular prison my paperwork in front of two presidents axod was getting my request for a commutation from Obama on Obama’s desk he gave him letters from you know my two daughters my young daughters to the President Obama’s daughters are is at the same age as mine and uh I done already six and a half years asking for clemency and we recognize the politics of him and you know his image and walking out of the White House on January 20th 2017 so we’re not even going to have it be where someone might have a you know the screenshot of him leaving the White House and me leaving the big house at the same time because we were connected to the case but why don’t you just cut my sentence in half from 14 years I never took a penny was request for campaign contributions and a political deal you wanted to make right just cut my sentence from 14 years to seven which would be higher than anybody Governor’s ever gotten from Illinois who’s been in prison probably maybe the longest actual time served of any governor and I’ll limp out of prison in October of 2017 and it should look promising in the days leading up to that because a few days before that he had provided he had released from prison a member of the faln the Puerto Rican terrorist group that was blowing up federal building so you should have been a Puerto Rican terrorist this guy got released by Obama a few days before and I’m thinking o that’s a good sign for me right and then a guy got 35 years in prison for treason against the United States his name was Bradley Manning he went went into prison as Bradley Manning came out of prison Chelsea Manning through the laress of the taxpayers Obama cut him cut her loose after six years or seven years I’m thinking I’m easy compared to these two and uh and I had members of Congress Democrats who had served with uh ax Rod asking him to do it and uh he didn’t do it and I think it’s because he made a deal with them they were basically said we’ll leave you alone you don’t need get involved in any of this and you don’t help him that’s what I think but here’s what’s interesting and it shows a lot about the kind of person Trump is and all through this process these long hard years and the years of you know dashed hopes and expectations because there was no way we could lose our appeal these things are legal um then you figure then they then they reverse the senate seat after I’m in prison for three and a half years and vacate my sentence now I have no sentence so I went from 14 years to no years for a year which was EAS easy easier time to do because when you’re looking you know you walk into prison in March of 2012 March 15 and your exit day is May 20124 right that’s a long hard road so you try to break up and psychologically try to break up that time right so you say okay let’s get from here to the first the appeal we’re gonna have hopes that we can win that though deep down you just know you’ve seen enough of the system to know you’re dead right but you cling to that hope they can’t uphold the sentenc SE they reverse it now I have no sentence I discuss with my attorney um when do we go back to resentencing they got to give you a sentence you go back to the same judge let’s just wait a year I’ll just stay here I’ll keep you know working out reading and just trying to grow and then we’ll go back to this judge when I will have served almost 5 years more than just about any body I mean nobody in American history other than me has served a single day in prison for a fundraising violation and this wasn’t even a violation but let’s assume the worst that it was no one had did a single day and my lawyer presented this to the judge there’s not a single case and uh letters my little girls had grown up they gave beautiful presentations in court I I’m on video from Colorado in prison for the resentencing August 9th 2016 okay so I go from no sentence the centerpiece of the case was a big lie to begin with it was never a crime no sale of the senate seat no sentence back before the judge I’ve been a well-b behaved inmate we submit well over a hundred letters from my colleagues guys that I helped good guys I’m criminals but I learned a lot of these guys aren’t bad guys some are really bad some are pretty good guys are just you know have gone the wrong way and got bad habits we submit the letters and uh There’s real expectation that I’ll go home he puts me back at 14 years and I hear my older daughter sobbing in the courtroom after they gave these beautiful presentations I’m watching my little girls who grown and I’m so proud of them and look how you know how sweet and nice and smart they are and boy Patty did a great job raising them you know all these things I’m thinking at that’s resentencing but here’s where God comes in and this whole Miracle of how I eventually got home and that Donald Trump would be the instrument see this is part of what I wrot about my book I I got to know him a little bit on Celebrity Apprentice a show I never watched but after they took everything away from me and I had no income and I was an honest Governor didn’t get rich in the business I was getting these opportunities to do these you know an one place that you can actually make a living when you got this leprosy is an entertainment yeah exactly no one wants to come near you when you got it understandably but you’re better than Diddy so you can still you can still get paid yeah so yeah I turned down a bunch of really bad stuff like being a greeter at on an HBO show called The Bunny Ranch it’s a house in Henderson nevana they offered me six figures they thought I was perfect for the role because I was such a scoundrel in the media right I turned it down the guy’s name was Dennis Hoff you know I knew him well yeah yeah nice guy yeah was but I couldn’t I can’t I got two little girls I’m not doing that anyway but Trump’s show came calling because he saw me on television fighting back and um so I did Celebrity Apprentice this is October 2009 that we tape it it airs in like March 2010 my first trial is June 2010 and he was so good to me he was so sympathetic he was so kind people don’t realize on a personal level Trump’s a kind-hearted person very different from most politicians and the direct opposite of a cold selfish completely practical Obama right so when Obama passes Me by back to the rensing on the 9th of August the judge puts me back at 14 years my daughter’s sobbing in the courtroom I can’t see her but I hear it hope is gone now right but here’s how God works he sends me more hope because that afternoon Trump’s given a speech in North Carolina he running against Hillary and he starts talking about crooked Hillary right and before the audience start chanting lock her up lock her up he says and then there’s this Governor from Illinois blah blah blah they just gave him 14 years again 14 years he’s a choir boy now to Hillary something like that Trump’s got his radar right and I’m thinking because I believe I know politics I think he’s going to beat her even from a far in prison I thought he was going to beat her because he was different and he was standing up to stuff he wasn’t backing down like typical politicians do and I thought wow so if Obama doesn’t do it who knows and he was so good to me on that show well he didn’t do it Obama the 20th of January one month later Trump’s been president for one month I get called into the case man man’s office and they they have a form I have to sign it’s a waiver I have to if I agree to allow the White House pardon office to get my prison records of course I what do I sign right so I signed it two things Trump’s looking out and wants to see whether or not you know was a well behaved inmate there’s a way perhaps where he can send me home and Obama was never going to do it because they never asked for my records and what that did for me was it gave me hope for the next couple years and then after the Supreme Court didn’t take our case God bless you my friend me and my homies in prison are watching my wife on your show on a Monday in the spring of 2018 Supreme Court turned me down that weekend that Monday evening you had Patty my wife Patty on he all never forget it yeah and and you were fantastic and and uh I’m really grateful to you for oh my gosh well there’s nothing more beautiful than uh a loyal spouse yeah she’s amazing is she yeah I agree with that strongly so when you see going through everything that you did when you see the FBI raid maral Lago in the summer of 2022 what do you think all over again these lion scumbags yeah weaponized they’re politicians they’re political agents KGB Soviet style police state politics in America and the Democrats have embraced it the Bush Administration started it but this Fitz Sher is his own guy and Comey and Fitz Sher are real close of course they are and there’s no doubt in my mind that what they did to me at the tripa level to a Democrat Governor they said oo we can get away with this let’s do it to Trump a Republican president at the major league level and that’s exactly what this whole Russian collusion was all about and I’m watching this from prison and I I know all of it I recognize it I know the tactics I know how what the stuff they say to the media how they leak stuff and how they lie their political operatives our country is on the crossroads on the threshold I mean so important elect Trump for a thousand Reasons this might be the most important one of them because if we lose this the ability in America to elect our leaders without the interv ition of prosecutors criminalizing things that aren’t crimes for politics the voters don’t have any choices free and fair elections don’t matter it’s all rigged like they do in uh like the old Soviet Union what did barrier say show me the man I’ll show you the crime exactly yeah when we started this show we were looking for a very specific sponsor we wanted to find a company that could send us good meat better than anything you could buy in a grocery store that didn’t have a lot of weird hormones in it or chemicals just good meat from the United States and we found one and we are proud to partner with them they’re called Merryweather farms and they produce all natural beef and we are proud to be in business with them we eat it our viewers have been buying it and loving it we’ve got all kinds of positive 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Merryweather Farms today you will taste the difference it’s again better than anything you can buy at the grocery store and it comes right to your house so I mean we have a media protected you know first line item in the Bill of Rights is as you know um in order to push back against the abuse of power by the government mhm and they don’t seem to be playing that role they’re assigned role they’re you know they’re the role that Duty would compel them to playh they seem to be like covering for the people in power oh man duty would compel them to play yeah the fourth estate a free press and a free Society you don’t have that to check power yeah we’re dead right so that’s kind of what I naively thought when I’m sitting in the backseat of the FBI vehicle handcuffed behind my hands I’m the governor of Illinois that’s a fifth largest state in America right I’m now they got me and I said well what’s this about and the guy said the sale of the senate seat I said what first of all you got to be a horse’s ass to think that you can get away with something like that I’m going to steal I’m going to sell Obama any presidents but Obama at that time was a demigod elevated by the media okay all superficial about how great he is but I’m going to be that stupid where I’m going to actually try to sell his senate seat and I’m already under intense federal investigation for rco and some of these other guys and uh you know activists and politics and stuff and they’re trying to find crimes they can’t find it for five years so now this I’m thinking the media they not so great but the media is certainly going to laugh them out of court before they get into court who’d be so stupid to do something like that and the reality was they were all over it because it was just too super Sensational to pass up it sold newspapers was good for Ratings so they’re more interest in the storyline than the truth abrogating their responsibility to all of us as Citizens to keep an eye on the power the government has no power these Federal prosecutors have all the power unchecked power not foreseen by our founding fathers when they divided our government they didn’t know that there’d be a branch out of the executive part of the government that a a a an agency out of the executive branch that would grow like a cancer there originally going after the alapon of the world and not taking that power to all kinds of levels to turn it into a political it becomes a secret police there you go yeah this is why the work that you do Tucker I mean you’re so nice to me but I’m grateful to you for what you do and others like you are fighting for you know freedom and Elon Musk and these guys which is so corrupt I mean and I think it’s important to say out loud what it is which again is corrupt and evil corrupt and evil yeah so um does I mean does Trump have a well in a fair election do you think Trump will win oh yeah if phal election he wins every one of those Battleground states with some cushion yeah it’s another thing I want to say to your listeners they should listen to me on this sort of stuff you know in a fair election one thing I’ve been good at in life is winning elections I’ve run 14 of them seven or eight were really hard primaries really hard against other Democrats you know running against Republicans for Governor ill being the first Democrat to win after 26 years those are really competitive races so I’m giving me high marks I’m an expert witness when it comes to politics understanding the mood of the voters sensing them not just what the polling says actually it’s more instinctive what you saw at Madison Square Gard when you gave that great speech um I saw the crowds there they’re not Nazis you know what they are they’re white people and they’re black people exactly they’re Hispanics and they’re Asian they’re old and they’re young they’re good decent hardworking forgotten Americans yes and there’s more of them aren’t and they’re they’ve learned to know what’s being done to them and how our country is setting the priorities that go against their interests now so blatantly for those who don’t legally come to the United States they’re not stupid and uh I I believe if this election is run fairly it’s going to be a 19 or 2024 version of 1980 when the country made it this choice between Reagan and Carter by the first or second week of no of October and started shifting and going towards Reagan ended up winning you know maybe 49 states or something that won’t happen now because the demographic in America is different the ball games those Battleground States but if I’m right about this Trump will sweep all of them and might be competitive in States like Virginia maybe or Minnesota even keep an eye on that we’ll see um but I I’m very hopeful and uh as Reagan used to say cautiously optimistic well it does seem I mean I’d bet my house on the proposition that Trump is more popular than KLA Harris and more people um in those seven states will vote for Trump than K and Harris but that doesn’t mean that he’s going to be president what do you think will actually happen well that’s a good question I couldn’t imagine what happened in 2020 and you can’t really talk about it but I have tremendous skepticism about all of that I was asked after that election um about you know well you literally can’t talk about it and if we talk about that we’ll this will be taken off YouTube yeah um why do you think that is why do you I mean if somebody says you know we can talk about anything you want except this one thing yeah what does that tell you well you look at those FBI tapes I want to play 98% of them right they’re under they won’t let they wouldn’t let me play them in court even to prove my innocence so right if you’re hiding something there’s a reason right they’re the ones that are lying yeah of course they’re the ones who did it but I think that I I think that so much I think there’s such a movement for Trump right now I think there’s such a movement against what’s happening and I think the testicular virility that great courage Trump showed at that moment when he got shot yes Butler elevated him to a very different place he’s no longer your typical politician right I think he represents something that’s really powerful and you can just see all the things that are unfolding and here’s another reason why I feel very good about this election the public polls whatever they are I never relied on those we had our polling and we it guided how we ran the race and what the strategy was to run and win and you know that the other side has their polling too and in all likelihood it’s probably as good as yours so they know what you know they’re seeing what you’re seeing and so if you really want to know how the campaigns are going just watch the candidates where they go what they say what they do do and what they’re running on and Trump’s running on a message on things that he wants to do for the American people you might disagree with those things but this is what he’s saying he’s going to do it’s about you the people what’s she saying he’s a Nazi now they’re in the last late stages and making these outrageous accusations and calling people names whenever that would happen to me they wern’t calling me a Nazi but I was you know you get nasty stuff thrown at you when you’re ahead you love it cuz you know you’re winning yeah right so he’s winning and if it’s fa and honest he’ll win comfortably in those seven states so if they come to us the day um after the election and by they I mean Morning Joe and the and the rest of the siant in the media and tell us that KLA Harris turns out to be just incredibly popular incredibly popular and her compelling Vision got her across the Finish Line with a massive margin and she got you know 84 million votes and she’s the winner and if you disagree you know you’re a criminal will people accept that I let me say I will not accept that but will others accept that like what happens then in Nazi Germany they held a pleb asite Hitler wanted to confirm some of what he was doing and it was like 99% yah that’s how you say yes in Germany right I think that’s the only way they could even remotely have but I mean shouldn’t look I I I’m I don’t want to be an election denier or denier of anything that’s true I always want to acknowledge what’s true period but I I also don’t think that any of us are under the obligation to accept them at face value at their word I I think they’ve kind of tried the the limits of good faith and aren’t we allowed to say look you say k Harris won great show us the books no doubt about it we know them to be Liars they’ve been lying through the years and they they’ just recently been lying about well what the cognitive capabilities of the president then they throw him out of office and you know hijack him from office and put her there and you know lying about her record she didn’t work at McDonald’s even they lie about everything right no they we can’t believe that it’s going to be really hard to believe why do we have electronic voting machines I I thought the idea I was never against them I never thought about it but I I assumed that they were more efficient that you got the results faster and that they were more accurate and they’re not more accurate than hand counting paper ballots and they’re certainly not faster you know the results in countries that don’t have electronic voting machines are reliable and they’re in long before our results are so what is the reason that we have electronic voting machines so among the different people I write about in my book is Walter Hill black guy from East St Louis Illinois yes and when I first got to prison he embraced me he was you know you’re my Governor right and he told me by the time that we had met he he had lost some weight but he had been a big guy and when he told me about having met him once down in the Metro East area of Illinois down Southwestern Illinois uh in East St Louis I I kind of remember him and he was like some liquor license commissioner and I don’t think he’d mind me saying this a colorful figure and a good guy but he was wrong what he did I like him already yeah but he said to me uh and he told he was sympathetic to me because he’s in politics couldn’t believe I’m in prison for what but he said to me you know I voted for you two times right in the St Louis and I said oh wow thanks how many times you vote for Obama nine I said you’re a racist man Democrat you vote for the black guy nine times me only two right that’s why how that’s I I don’t remember Obama running for president nine times how did how did Mr Hill pull that off no in that first election because this the first election I I met him in 2012 before the reelection so this would have been the 2008 election and and I frankly believe he was telling me the truth but that’s the answer to your question about those elect those machines you know they’re they what gives me hope too about this election is those well among the ways Democratic Precinct workers and Obama and I know this we would we were you know high up but you kind of know these activists are doing whatever they’re doing in in in the polling places that are controlled by democrats largely in the inner city and the poor neighborhoods um is through the what’s the absentee ballots and they gather them up and harvest them and what happened in 2020 was that on steroids with the covid situation in the mailin ballots and that’s among the reasons why I have a you know I believe an honest skepticism about the result of that don’t know that Trump even had a fair chance to get in the court on any of that stuff and again I know from my experience how the courts can you know be dishonest there’s got to be so many reforms that have to happen God willing Trump wins to clean up that justice system and I think there has to be nobody should be unchecked I think that’s the lesson from my heart experience human nature even good people can get did to do the bad things and wrong things another reason why thank you scientists for your great intelligence and the great contributions you make but unless we guide you through conscience which comes from God exactly right you’re GNA destroy the world so uh answer your question I think the the voting system is the way it is today because of political priorities that are above and beyond what’s fundamentally right for our country and what really makes me angry at my party is nothing sacred to these people anymore that they would weaponize the law and the justice system to to destroy Trump because they know that if they if they destroy Trump nothing’s going to stop them from destroying our freedoms and little by little this I know too having lost mine I see the steady erosion of freedom in America and it’s so much like countries that like my father came from after World War II Serbia he didn’t want to live in a communist country and you know they saw they know how those rights and freedoms are taken away and here’s this what Lincoln called the last best Hope on Earth if we lose Freedom here you forget about it all over the world I think we’re going to start seeing the beginning of a new Dark Age where tyrants and totalitarian governments are the rule and democracy’s dead that’s what I think this time of year we are focused on our families because we’re apt to be with our families celebrating together and it’s the time of year where you might ask yourself what happens when you’re gone What’s Left Behind well protect your family’s future and peace of mind with a product called policy genius policy genius has one goal to make it easy to find and buy life insurance so your loved ones have something when you’re not here something that can use to cover debts and expenses if something unexpected happens because unexpected things do happen with policy genius you don’t need to struggle to do this you can find life insurance policies that started $292 per year for a million doll of coverage some options are 100% online and that lets you avoid unnecessary medical exams which is always good policy genius combines digital tools with the expertise of real licensed agents you compare quotes from America’s Top insurers side by side for free and there are no hidden fees their license support team helps you get what you need fast you can get on with your life join thousands of happy policy genius customers will have fstar reviews on Google and trust pilot so secure your families tomorrow so you have peace of mind today it’s easy go to policygenius.com Tucker to get your fle free life insurance quotes and see how much you could save again it’s policygenius.com Tucker it does seem look if KL Harris wins fair and square yeah right blessings to her and I hope she fixes the country that she help destroy but I really do fervently hope that and aan it and I will support any effort to do that but if um she declares Victory without proving that she actually won fairly I think it is the duty of the rest of us to resist that you’re not allowed to steal elections that’s that’s the end of democracy resistance to tyrants is obedience to God that’s right out of the Old Testament I feel that no doubt about it look we’re in this historic state of Maine where you have this wonderful Studio I mean think about the Patriots and America who began our country and resisted The Tyranny from England cre this unique place I wasn’t setting the world on fire in school I went to not so good schools in Chicago Public Schools my parents were little working people five room apartment my father spoke broken English and my mom worked for the public transit system passing out transfers we didn’t know anybody in politics or anything we were just working people I became the governor of Illinois anything’s possible in this country if we lose this it’s why everybody wants to to come here but just follow the law right and they’re destroying the law and the idea of sanctuary cities I’m sitting in prison watching the Democrats with these Sanctuary cities that was Unthinkable how’s that not Insurrection correct against the federal government what that I mean what happened in Fort Sumpter in 1861 was less radical than Sanctuary cities we’re saying that we’re ignoring Federal immigration law how are we not breaking away from the rest of the United States right how’s that that secession I don’t I don’t get it I I hear you it’s crazy uh and but again the media just made it seem like an exercise in compassion yeah here again thank you for what you do and thank you for a lot of the other you know services that are out there who are providing alternative views from what the mainstream media has become you’re I mean when you guys talk about mainstream media you’re right they’ve been so corrupted and so co-opted they’re corporate media have you talked to Obama since you got out no MM he never called you oh no oh God no what’s he mad at you about what’ you do wrong no I don’t think he’s I don’t think he’s mad he’s just like uh that guy can only hurt me and you know course he’s living the good life you know you think about Obama he’s close to being a billionaire those Obamas have monetized like the clintons did their time in the white oval office and in the white house I think about Trump how wait how did Obama get so rich right well I mean he’s you know he’s got that whole establishment stuff that you know overpay them for things I think got a deal for like a a book deal that was like $60 million or something in advance and I don’t know what the other things he’s doing but I I think there’s like documentaries he supposedly makes for Netflix they paid him $100 million or something but I think about that I think and I know you know them and the moment they won for the for the Senate and you know they wanted man the first thing and she she wanted a job yeah there’s other things about him that I’ve been told by Tony that I don’t think I should say just because boy they’re terrible of true and I tend to believe they are about his personal Behavior about about the desire to have upward Mobility yeah and you know and where he was at in the late 90s and he’s a money worshipper yeah and I think I see I compare that and I think about Trump who’s made all that money and built it up in business and then decided to leave that good life to go and put his through this in this rotten nasty business and they get he gets treated like that where they’re trying to literally destroy him and his family and all that wealth that he created and just the position between that where he wants to serve and Obama how they’ve catapulted to that level after the presidency by just playing the inside game and being part of the establishment it’s a dramatic do you see I me you keep hearing these Whispers a lot of them are just like nonsense on the internet but then you do hear from Democrats um I don’t know if it’s true but that Obama would like to see his wife run after KLA Harris loses you think there’s any truth to any of that yes I I think that’s not unlikely I don’t know that she wants to do it though but I I doesn’t seem like she does but what do I know I’m not yeah I know I’m the same way um sure I can see I can see the possibility of that how much control does Obama have over the modern democratic party it’s a good question um he’s the most influential person in the Democratic party today but I would say that his influence wanes as the years go by he’s not as influential now as he was four years ago or8 years ago um you know times change new people come in I do think that the the Socialists the Democrats the AOC types are further left than Obama and uh that’s a tiger that he can’t hold by the tail that are kind of pushing him and others that way I don’t know that he’s comfortable doing that the thing about him is he’s got a fundamental leftwing ideology but he’s a lot more practical than that he’s all about just winning for himself and you know I I think about when he ran for president in 2008 he supported a border wall oh yeah right it was practical politics at that time he was willing to ditch that right away um and so I I would say as time goes by his influence will wne continue to wne but probably four years from now he’ll probably still be God willing Trump’s the president the most influential Democrat um boy he was he was pretty cold with with Joe Biden who was always kind of running around pathetically bragging about how close he was to Obama and they were buddies and Obama just knifed him twice one in 2016 supporting Hillary for the nomination and again this summer with you know leading the coup against him what’s that it’s mavelli yeah he went to Harvard he was probably reading the law and reading the prince right no he’s a cold-hearted very mellian look it’s a tough business and I don’t want to be a whiner complainer and like oh wo was me look what happened it is it is a tough buiness it’s a rough business you know you’re in a rough business like that Harry Truman said if you want to friend in Washington get a dog right a lot of Truth to that but within the spectrum of these practical people in a business of bullshitters and duplicitous phonies who almost Embrace their hypocrisy as if it’s like some sort of skill or talent that they have in other words Michael Jordan you know his game got better as he got greater right he became a much better shooter I’m from Chicago six championships we love Jordan right but Jordan wasn’t as good a shooter when he first came out of college as he became his game got better and so you Embrace that he go he can move go to the left a little bit better than he did when he first started you embrace the Improvement of his skills in sports these politicians what they do is like the Chuck Schumer of the world they laugh at their duplicity and their hypocrisy it isn’t that they’re being phony or fake they feel good because they’re getting away with it and the people are buying it right and at some level including me there’s a level of that that’s part of that business but there is a difference between a lot of the people in politics that aren’t like that and in spite of what everybody the where the establishment’s been saying about Trump he is probably the least political of the people I’ve known in politics and I’ve known a lot I mean I knew Biden when he was a Senator and I was in Congress I knew Bill Clinton he was actually a very nice guy that’s my Bill Clinton personation I really liked him right defended him and that was a hard thing to defend I mean what are you doing with an intern man come on right anyway Obama I knew since 1995 was that Monica Lewinsky thing some sort of op from a foreign country to control Clinton you ever heard anybody say that no I haven’t actually no you do wonder do you think yeah I don’t know gosh I I don’t know no I think well I think it was I think it was real oh totally yeah but you do you know you do sort of Wonder um what do you ever talk to Clinton is he still around you never you hear he’s not well but I don’t know is he no I I haven’t seen him since uh before prison is he still a force in the party less so yeah yeah he he less so Obama’s eclipsed him you said that um it was if it was a choice between Obama and Hillary it wasn’t a tough one for you you obviously know Hillary why why weren’t you eager to support her the reason Bill Clinton won and the reason she lost is the reason you talked about Trump at the Madison Square Garden Trump likes people yeah yeah Clinton likes people oh sure he does she has contempt for people you know that basket of deplorables yeah I think she feels that way about all the people you know Everyday People she just so just so focused and guided and a political animal whatever she stands for is driven by focus groups and polls she has no like feel for anything I really believe that about her I mean she’s you know at a personal level you meter I mean you know no surprise she didn’t win right really yeah no not a warm person oh not at all very cold very cold-hearted very ambitious very dishonest very dishonest she had what well her best friend worked for me in my Administration I hired this woman I can’t remember her name but um and she was a nice woman she’s competent um but it not like she ever told me anything bad about Hillary it’s just that I’d been around Hillary enough not a lot but enough and Bill Clinton too to see a very big difference between the two people you just naturally like Clinton I think I’ll tell you a quick story you want to hear this very much yeah so I’m a congressman It’s 1999 the United States and NATO m not with without you un approval are doing to my father Serbia what UK Russia is doing to Ukraine now oh I noticed right we decided to bomb a sovereign country forcing them to give up a part of their country do you remember this thank you can I just ask you to pause it and I because I want to thank you for bringing that up oh it’s one of the worst things that the this country has done in a long time and it’s been completely forgotten it was not talked about then right and so I hope people aren’t familiar with what you’re talking about we’ll listen carefully was 1999 it was the Balkans and Serbia and the United States and NATO decided to bomb Serbia over Kosovo which is part of Serbia and basically it was whether or not they the serbs would accept an agreement that was made in France Ron Boule that basically said this part of your country has to be submitted to a referendum where the Muslims outnumber the Christian Community about like 10 to one and if you don’t submit this to a vote which obviously is going to go for separation uh secession we’re going to bomb you extortion at the highest level but what what was the motive there why would we want to get involved in the internal affairs of Serbia MH I don’t like why why would we kill all those people to achieve that result do you have any idea I do I have different ideas I think a lot of it has to do with you know the politics in the Middle East and uh you know Muslim having a Muslim country or two in Europe itself because before that was the war in Bosnia where it was divided up three ways and the Muslims have a section of the of of Bosnia into the East is the Republic of Sera where the serbs are the croatians are to the West the Balkans have historically been you know very difficult places with the different peoples getting along and lot of the word balkanize yeah that’s exactly right um but I I you know I learned this about politics at the high level which was surprising to me that a lot of our foreign policy and this is frightening is driven by campaign contributions and of course yeah I could see all of it yeah but foreign policy think about that that’s what I’m saying I mean of course it is yeah oh I see it every day yeah well she was running for the US Senate in New York Hillary was and there’s a prominent Albanian community in the state of New York how much Clinton’s desire and attention to support you know the coast of our issue that the albanians supported had something to do with his local domestic politics tip O’Neal said all politics is local the clintons are experts at that I’m you know I don’t know for sure that that was the motivation I think it was it might have been part of it cuz she was running for the Senate um however it was they did it and um I was the only serbian-american in Congress and I was a Democrat and my party was doing this but most of the Republicans went along with it as well because it was the establishing Republican Party of the Chinese right of course it’s War we get to kill people it’s a good thing yeah and so they bombed this this country my father came from and it was on a personal level was really hard you know I think about my late father and you know he would tell me stories about World War II we spent my father spent four years in a Nazi prison of War camp and then 3 years in a refugee camp after the war waiting for the us to pass a law call to displace persons act which allowed my father and millions of others like him with these million these hard long and hard to pronounce last names a chance to come to America Freedom my Dad loved America and he just there was no place like it you can if you wor and work hard you can make it and if you don’t your kids can do good like actually happened with my brother and me but Freedom was the thing and I you saw that David Aswad was working for me then and I would go to his office and I’d vent these mfers this MF and Clinton where did they come up Serbia was an ally for the united with the United States in World War II Serb was an ally the United States in World War I and now they’re violating international law and bombing a sovereign country to support those on the other side of the war as opposed to trying to work something out through the United Nations you know what I was just maddening and I got to support this I got to support my party so anyway an advent and so we’re figuring out ways where I can be constructive now I’m an American and God forbid you now we’re at war with the country my father came from my loyalties are to the United States and there was a big vote bless you for saying that the war it was a big vote on supporting the military effort against Serbia against my father’s country was tied 212 212 my colleague and at the time friend Jesse Jackson Jr voted against the war the black caucus was against the war black kids go and fight these wars I took the position I hate this War I spoke against it before they started it I was one of 15 Congressman Democrats could Sage another one who vot said don’t do this you bomb this country you’re gonna unleash the furies mosovich is a crazy guy he’s going to kick out innocent Kars out of that country it’s coming they wanted it it was a provoc provocative act by NATO no one mosovich would do that and those people would suffer like they did but then they put it on the serbs right and demonized them worldwide but the black caucus in many ways the black community really understands abuse of power more than any other community because they’ve been on the wrong end of that historically they’re not buying it so I’m the bombing starts on a Thursday as we all leave from Congress they timed it we had a two-e recess for spring break they start and I’m Saturday you know I’m watching this on CNN and anyway long long story short I’m vent to the ax rod and he and I I this is making me sick I got to do something by then they had taken three us three US soldiers had been taken prisoner by the serbs during that war they had stumbled into Serbia and they were taken prisoners nobody knew where they were the Red Cross wasn’t allowed in mosovich had been demonized the president of Serbia in in many ways justifiably but uh worldwide and they were making them look and they were calling ethnic cleansing genocide which is also another lie it’s not good but ethnic cleansing it you know it’s the nature of how things have happened in Europe all over the place 12 million Germans were ethnically cleansed from the East to the West after World War II A lot of them murdered yep yeah right so anyway I’m frustrated axod comes up they take the soldiers I’m be because I’m the only Serb these guys from the Serbian government are reaching out to me I don’t know if they’re real or not and I see one of them on television with mosovich guy by the name of cage bogal cage very interesting man long the short of it is ax Rod I’m meeting with him I want to play a role I got to do something and he says why don’t you try to get those soldiers out but you can’t do it by yourself because I speak the language that’s my first language my father you know my mother was American born so how do you get there they won’t let me I’m a junior Congressman I mean they’ll crush me they won’t let me go State Department was against it and then I saw that Reverend Jesse jackon Ramsey Clark you know right Reverend Jesse Jackson wanted to do what Ramsey Clark had done he wanted to go visit the bombing sites but that he had made a condition that he won’t do it unless he can see the three soldiers so I don’t know Jesse Jackson at the time since then he’s become kind of a friend so I uh I see the son you know we’re young congressman and I see Jesse Jr and we vote on a Tuesday we get down with our votes like 11:00 Washington time we’re sitting in the chamber it’s empty it’s just me and him and I said you know hey Jesse I saw that your dad wants to go to Serbia and see those soldiers he go yeah and I said um I don’t know if this is or not but these guys from the government reproached me CU my father came from that country and I speak the language if I could arrange for your father to go to Serbia to see those soldiers you think he might do it and he said he sure would watch you call the rever now and I I said what he said call the rever now and I said you call your dad Reverend right not surprised no and he said you call him I said look I don’t know your dad you call him see if he’s interested then let me know and then I’ll call him so moments later we’re at our offices he calls me I’m in the Canon building right fifth floor and he says uh I just talked to the Reverend he’s in Mississippi at a voter registration Drive call him he’s waiting for your call so I call him first time I ever talked to Jesse Jackson it’s like I don’t know Spring May of 1999 and um April May and I said uh and if you ever talk to him on the phone he speaks very softly he’s a very powerful speaker but privately very softly and I said Reverend Jackson this is Congressman Lovich I Ser with your son understand he says I said uh I’m can I call you on a Hardline you know you’re on a cell phone it’s kind of a delicate thing I’m talking about I don’t know if this is proper he goes I can’t run now I’m in a voter registration job in Mississippi talk to me in code first time I thought to I got a code right okay I saidwell I’m calling you about over there and he says understand I said I talked to a guy in the government who says it’s possible for you to go over there understand I said I said if you’re willing to do it he’s going to talk to the big Chiefs today at 4:00 understand I said if the answer is yes how soon can you go and can you go uh can you leave tomorrow and he says I can’t I’m here doing voter registration because it was a Tuesday but if you make this happen I can go on Friday and we can move on what he says to me right I miss people like this yeah yeah and then I said and he says and you pull this off I’m taking you with me I didn’t say it but I’m thinking to myself of course I’m goinging with okay I’m putting this all together anyway we got to go we he did it he was the government wanted Jackson and Jackson put together this Interfaith Coalition of religious leaders left-wing religious leaders from very diverse you know Catholic priests Jewish rabbis Methodist ministers uh um this lady named Dr Joan Brown Campbell from the National Council of churches they were all part of this delegation Jesse Jackson and me and so we we go I speak the language and you know they’re very understandably mistrustful of America because we’re bombing them bombs were falling while we were there they wouldn’t stop the bombing the Clinton ministration kept trying to squeeze us Jackson I guess he he’s able to procure things he got like a plane he got like a commercial plane World Air you appreciate this story World Airways and we’re supposed to leave on Saturday and uh and then Friday evening I get a phone call from his Aid and he said uh we got to postpone our trip because uh I said why he goes well the CEO of world Airways called the Reverend and said uh they got to can’t let let us have the plane until they get War insurance on it okay so the next day my wife sees me says I thought you were getting ready to go to Serbia Patty and my baby Amy was just our first one was two years old and I said uh no it’s been delayed that’s something about war insurance and then it clicked Patty said war insurance I said yeah we’re flying into a war zone they don’t want us to give us a plane and so then she quiet calls our insurance agent neighborhood insurance agent State Farm says if my husband voluntarily goes into a war zone and gets killed does do I still get his life insurance right and he’s they checked he got back to her and said yeah he’s covered and she said okay I love you good luck wish you Lu amazing right is maybe well I don’t know the the real explanation um that would explain why we push NATO to bomb Serbia but I do know that we killed a ton ofr we took the we in Kosovo the serbs they were they were ethnically cleansed in Kosovo oh I’m aware yeah so the us but it does seem like a lot of our interventions wind up killing Christians from the bom of Nagasaki which was not a military significant place but it was the center of Christianity in Japan oh to the war in Iraq that basically ended the Christian population of Iraq to Syria to Gaza to Serbia it it seems like one thread that connects all of those is the killing of Christians by the US government has you thought of that I I haven’t but I I I didn’t know that about Nagasaki but that’s really bom landed on the church on the the majority of Christians in Japan lived in Nagasaki and and the majority of them were killed if you’re asking me to speculate on why that might be the case I don’t think it’s so much of a desire to hurt Christians as it is if we got to hurt anybody will hurt the Christians and not the other groups because it’s Politically Incorrect if we hurt the other groups and they won’t complain because they’re Christians yeah yeah I think that’s right but we did kill a ton of Christians in in the Balkans oh there’s no doubt about it and uh it was really maddening because you know I these otherwise liberal Democrats who were it turned out I think right on Vietnam that was wrong the wrong war and how get out of that was the issue and I think Nixon Franklin did the best he could under the circumstances a war started by Johnson but now suddenly they were all warhawks all these liberal Democrats were warhawks against Serbia in 1999 it was sickening and I had to work with these people you know and uh well that was just a a foretaste of the world to come wasn’t it it really was and you know so I wrote an naed for the Washington Post at the time say suggesting that they they should partition Kosovo then and stop the bombing Stop The Killing the bombing of a sovereign country partition that country protect the Orthodox monasteries the Christian Orthodox monasteries that are so vital to the Serbian experience because Kosovo in the Serbian history is is his historic it’s it is to serbs what like Israel is to Jews and they had lost this battle in the 14 1300s against the Turks they ad him in Turks 500 years of enslavement after that you know ottoman control and the Battle of Kosovo is Central to the Serbian history and culture I’m American born and I didn’t really understand it but I got a much better appreciation of it during that war and so I suggested this as the bombing was going on the American people really never understood why we were doing it Clinton was losing support and particularly with the Black Caucus being against it and leaders like Jackson speaking out against it that’s why he was so vital going there and making the deal to get the soldiers back which we successfully got those soldiers back Jackson and I um what happened was that they had to uh they had to justify this war so they went extremely hard in trying to demonize the serbs without any kind of honest analysis of the complexities of those issues over there and uh it’s really ging and wesy Clark the general was the one running oh I’m very aare of that and I’m told he’s doing business there in Koso now that that’s if that’s true that’s sickening he’s he’s a he’s a sickening person a totally Hollow clever but not wise uh ruthless human being yeah um so last question just to Circle back to where we began and that’s the condition of your party I don’t I don’t think it’s an overstatement to say born in the Democratic party Rose to you know the top of of it when you see KL Harris on the road campaigning with Dick Cheney’s repulsive daughter what do you think that ain’t my Democratic party right Dick Cheney is now a a Democrat I mean it’s incredible sickening that’s another sickening thing and it but when what the good news is it just shows you how politic is being real realigned in the in America today and those traditional Democrat workingclass voters everyday order orary people I talked about them before the silent majority including a much larger number of black people than even the polls are reflecting yes and Latinos I predict Trump across the country will have actually win a majority of the Latino vote in this election and the beauty about the Latino vote they remind me so much of the immigrant back in my background God-fearing hardworking family oriented most families are like that who come here legally and and those illegally you know come go back and come back legally that’s what we should all follow our rules especially when you first come here right don’t break into our country and the Democrats have opened the doors k Harris All By Design but when I think about how how that the parties have changed those corporate Country Club warmongering Liz Cheney Dick Cheney Mitt Romney Republicans I have a lot more in common with the left-wing kamla Harris wing of the Democrat Party then traditional workingclass daily type Democrats John F Kennedy Dem Democrats Robert Kennedy Democrats have with them and they’re not part of this new Coalition Trump’s building and this new Republican party and it’s very exciting I see all these history books that you have here and my reading a history and I had eight years to read a lot of it right is we’re going through a historic political realignment these parties are very different this new Republican party is the party of the little guy truly believe that my voters I saw that at Madison Square Garden those were my voters that I saw there they look just like my voters you know good people working people honest people not the elites how’d they treat you effing gold they were warm and loving I I can’t I can’t improve on that Governor Rod bovich thank it’s great to see you great to see you Tucker thank you that was [Music] amazing so it turns out that YouTube is suppressing our show I know shocking that in an election year with everything it’s Google would be putting its thumb on the scale and preventing you from hearing anything that the people in charge don’t want you to hear but it turns out it’s happening so what can you do about it well we could whine about it that’s a waste of time I’m 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